Hondata

well... if i can't fix my idle the next trip home then im selling my turbo kit this summer... so let me start off with my issues and a little info on my setup...

i can't remember the serial, but heres a picture i took when i received it back in 2006

#2052 maybe ?





-KManager Version - 1.3.4.0

-2003 Acura RSX Type-S

-RSX-S PRB ecu

-Greddy front mount intercooler kit, revhard log manifold, precision sc6176 e-cover, tial 38mm wastegate, custom exhaust and testpipe, O2 sensors are at the stock location, greddy type rs bov, walbro 255lph in tank, rc 750 cc's on a stock fuel system, competition stage 4 clutch, stock flywheel

-Ok well it all started back in 2007 when i installed the kit... at first i just dealt with the idle surging...then for my first attempt at fixing it i cleaned the IACV by a full disassemble and soaking in non-chlorinated brake cleaner... i reassembled it after letting it soak over night and used a new TB gasket when reinstalling it... i topped off my coolant and let all of the air escape before i capped it off... after the iacv clean the idle was better... but still surging every now and then... I checked for vacuum leaks with some starter fluid and couldnt find any...

...the second attempt was looking at the tune... i talked with a few people on clubrsx and did a little searching and thought that maybe the low speed ign in the first couple of columns was just to high (i believe 19ish)... so i adjusted it accordingly and the idle got a tad better... but it would still surge every now and then while sitting in traffic or at a light...

...so after the ign fix i sent my datalog to a fellow crsx'r and he noticed that my short term fuel trim was pegged out at 46%... which indicated an exhaust leak... i had a few small exhaust leaks around the manifold and exhaust from loose bolts and such... so i fixed the problem... AND at the time i changed out to some new plugs (left the gap alone) because the old ones were giving me some misfires at idle...

after fixing the exhaust leaks the idle got just a tad better... but NOW the car will shutoff every once in a while when i depress the clutch at highway speeds or when im coming to a stop and turning at the same time (yielding for example)... so i played around with the slider bar and the a/f at idle... brought it to as low as 13.2 and as high as 14.7... the idle still bounces a little and the rpms still drop to the point of almost shutting off...

...something else id like to mention is how jerky the transition is between on and off throttle...

and having it in first gear when the car first warms up is impossible because of the bouncy and high idle...


...hopefully theres something else you guys can recommend for me... im giving it one last big push next weekend and if i cant get it right... im stripping it back to NA

Thank you for providing a datalog and calibration.

There are a number of problems. The first is that you're at +46% short term trim at idle, which indicates a problem with the oxygen sensor, injectors or fuel tables. There is something odd because the calibration has closed loop disabled but the datalog shows a short term trim. The actual injector duration seems about right for 750cc injectors, and the o2 sensor looks like it is working.

The second problem that I see is that the manifold vaccum is much lower than I would expect at idle (~19 kpa in your datalog, ~33 kpa would be normal).

Next, the idle slider is further to the right than expected, which will allow the idle to surge. Also the TPS is not reading 0%. The ELD looks odd, which may signify an electrical problem, but we'll not worry about that for now.

So:
- switch back to the stock MAP sensor (set a boost limit at 10 lbs)
- calibrate the TPS sensor.
- zero the 1250 rpm row cam angle (currently 15 degrees)
- put the idle slider in the middle.

Run the car and see what the short term trim is like. If it is still bad, consider getting the injectors tested for flow.

Don't be too worried if the idle speed is a little low and the car stalls after you first upload a calibration or cut power to the ECU. This is normal because the ECU takes some time to perform an idle learn (about 3 cold to hot driving cycles). If you increase the slider to the right to fix the idle when you've just uploaded, then once the ECU does the idle learn procedure you'll find it will hang above the target idle speed.

Don't worry about the ignition settings at idle. The ECU does not use the ignition table - it used 'ignition controlled idle', where it uses ignition timing to control the idle speed. That is why the ignition is very retarded at idle and bounces all over the place.

Hondata wrote:Thank you for providing a datalog and calibration.

There are a number of problems. The first is that you're at +46% short term trim at idle, which indicates a problem with the oxygen sensor, injectors or fuel tables. There is something odd because the calibration has closed loop disabled but the datalog shows a short term trim. The actual injector duration seems about right for 750cc injectors, and the o2 sensor looks like it is working.

The second problem that I see is that the manifold vaccum is much lower than I would expect at idle (~19 kpa in your datalog, ~33 kpa would be normal).

Next, the idle slider is further to the right than expected, which will allow the idle to surge. Also the TPS is not reading 0%. The ELD looks odd, which may signify an electrical problem, but we'll not worry about that for now.

So:
- switch back to the stock MAP sensor (set a boost limit at 10 lbs)
- calibrate the TPS sensor.
- zero the 1250 rpm row cam angle (currently 15 degrees)
- put the idle slider in the middle.

Run the car and see what the short term trim is like. If it is still bad, consider getting the injectors tested for flow.

Don't be too worried if the idle speed is a little low and the car stalls after you first upload a calibration or cut power to the ECU. This is normal because the ECU takes some time to perform an idle learn (about 3 cold to hot driving cycles). If you increase the slider to the right to fix the idle when you've just uploaded, then once the ECU does the idle learn procedure you'll find it will hang above the target idle speed.

Don't worry about the ignition settings at idle. The ECU does not use the ignition table - it used 'ignition controlled idle', where it uses ignition timing to control the idle speed. That is why the ignition is very retarded at idle and bounces all over the place.

i have considered getting the injectors flow tested and cleaned because its been... almost 2 years on them...

now about the map sensor... im running the msd 3 bar map sensor currently which is spliced/soldered in... should i undo my connections and reconnect the stock map (i think thats what im hearing...its no problem i just want to make sure)

and what do you suggest may be the problem with my idle air pressure?

should i just make my vacuum lines as simple as possible until everything is fixed?


the tps is sitting at 1%... so im assuming just use a punch to adjust it slightly? clockwise was it?


and idle target lambda in what range?

alright well i didnt have much time but i went out and looked over a few things.... the kal that im posting is the only thing i tried out... i have no tools with me at school to adjust the tps...nor can i resplice the stock map sensor (i have the msd 3 bar).... was running extremely lean...once i noticed it i shut it off



when i set the 1250 row to 0... and moved the slider bar back to half way... (afcmd ~ 13.5) .... the first crank it idled for about 10 seconds... then shutoff... second crank... it idled nicely... but when i gave it any gas at all it shutoff... the strim stayed at 0 however the tps was still at 1% (until i can get a punch) ign was all over the place... had to put it back to how it was and head back inside to get ready for class

Have you put the stock MAP sensor back?

i'll be sure to this weekend when i go home... i live about 4 hours away from my tools/garage... can't have any downtime on the car until then... thanks for the response :)

you know... i've been curious if there have been issues with the msd 3 bar in the past... because the issue somewhat occured when i went from the stock map to the msd... maybe a hondata 4 bar might be an easy solution?

i was curious today and was given a tip by a crsx'r to try changing from the msd 3 bar setting to the neetronics 3 bar... my strim was down... and my a/f was actually close to afcmd for once!

tonight i had a little time to mess around with the idle af and slider bar... the idle problem is closed to being fixed! changing to the neetronics map sensor setting has worked... some open loop tuning is still in need... but the idle maintains a steady speed and no more dropping to below 300 rpms!