Starting Problems, again.

[Hondata]

I do not believe that Honda uses this 'clear flood mode' in their cranking logic. You can verify this by cranking a stock Honda vehicle with the throttle wide open - the car still starts normally. In any case, we only edit the tables associated with fuel injection, and don't change any logic.

You need to swap back to stock injectors as we suggested previously.

[Black Nugget]

I appreciate all your help Hondata1. Found the problem and getting it resolved!

[Hondata]

In order to help other people who come across the same problem, what was the cause?

[Black Nugget]

In order to help other people who come across the same problem, what was the cause?

Oddly, a leaky injector. It was an issue that could not be discovered under normal conditions. When the engine was ran hot and then shut off the injectors inside the plenum with hot temperatures would begin leaking.

I tested the injectors by priming system and letting them sit out and not a drop. But under warmer conditions, they did leak!

A huge thanks goes to Jeff Evans for the answer :

Its an issue with the injectors. I have this situation happen with about half of the cars running the ID injectors. Its very frustrating, you cannot "tune" it out. It happens with AEM EMS, Kpro, s300, FlashPro, Haltech, etc. Its some kind of issue in relation to post hot starting trim, specially when you shut off the car hot and dont start it for awhile. Its an over rich condition, that I believe is from the injectors leaking fuel into the combustion chamber when they are hot after shut down. I see that this poster is not using ID injectors, but they are the same "style" as the ID's.

Search on Evo forums, you'll find that they are having the same issues as well.

[Black Nugget]

Received my new Siemens Deka 900cc Injectors from Inline Pro & put them in today. Sadly, after a decent drive getting the engine to normal operating temperatures the issue returned. Turn off the car and try to start it maybe 15-20 minutes later and it just cranks and cranks.


So if I remove the injectors from the cylinders every time I get out of the car and put them back in when I'm ready to go again it's fine and will start right up.

Was hoping that new injectors would fix it, but no luck. Any idea's other than remove fuel rail every time I park car.

[Spunkster]

Has your car been tuned by a professional tuner yet?

[Black Nugget]

Has your car been tuned by a professional tuner yet?

Yes, by Rick at Inline Pro and later by Matt with Shue Tuning.

[Spunkster]

I would recommend taking it back to one of them so they can look at it.

[Black Nugget]

Honestly, that's my next option.


I've done just about everything short of putting stock injectors in... and the only thing holding me back from that is the fact that I'd prefer not to have to splice in more clips.



Here's my check list so far :

1) Question Tune. Take care to Custom Car Care (Authorized Hondata Tuner), Inline Pro, ShueTuning, and Tuners Edge (Lock Hondata Tuner).
- No Luck. All state tune looks fine.
2) Regap Spark Plugs to .034'
- No Luck, misfire began and still wouldn't start.
3) Coil packs from another known working S2000
- No luck, still hesitates to start.
4) Disconnect Purge Solenoid.
- No luck, still hesitates to start.
5) Notice oil on spark plug #4. Replace spark plug grommets.
- No luck.
6) Notice cam sensor not tight. Tighten.
- No luck.
7) Learn from Jeff Evans that these injectors are known for leaking after hot shut down, filling cylinders will fuel. I then proceed to remove my fuel injectors from the cylinders after each drive & putting them back in when I'm ready to drive again.
- FIRES IMMEDIATELY! 4 Days of multiple attempts each day, car fires perfectly!
8) Figure based on test #7, purchase new Siemens Deka 900cc Injectors.
- No luck. New injectors in, still hesitates to start.
9) Realize there are no fuel injector seals on the manifold side of my injectors. Purchase new ones.
- No luck.
10) Question cranking fuel. Remove fuel in 10% increments.
- No luck.
11) Compression Check.
- No luck. 10psi difference between highest and lowest cylinders.
12) Injectors Receiving Pulse after Shut Down.
- No Luck, removed injector clips after parking. Still wont fire when plug back in.
13) Injector Check again. I removed the spark plugs & unclipped the injectors. I cranked motor and covered the spark tubes with paper towels. Spot above cylinder #3 was covered in fuel. I replaced that injector.
- No luck. Car wouldn't fire this morning either.
14) Tune?
- Put the last tune back in the car with -20% cranking fuel trim. Lengthy crank time before start. If I WOT a few seconds into cranking the engine fires quicker. Based off this I figured its allowing more air in, so adjust cranking fuel trim to compensate for more air less fuel. I move to -30%, no luck. Then tonight -40%, no luck.
15) Pump? Primed fuel pump 4-5 times before cranking.
- No luck.

[Black Nugget]

Months have passed, hundreds.... probably thousands of dollars spent to fix.

Turns out it was a bad FPR. Fuel was leaking by through the vacuum line. Replaced that last Tuesday and since the car has started up perfectly everytime.